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Monday message board

August 28th, 2006

It’s time, once again for the Monday Message Board. As usual, civilised discussion and absolutely no coarse language, please.

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  1. Hal9000
    August 28th, 2006 at 17:32 | #1

    Hallelujah. It’s actually raining in Brisbane. With the likelihood of some more.

  2. August 28th, 2006 at 21:48 | #2

    Nothing beats rain.

  3. August 29th, 2006 at 10:35 | #3

    Just dropped by to see if I could prompt the professor for his thoughts on the latest Telstra debacle.

  4. August 29th, 2006 at 23:22 | #4

    I’d like to post a quote written by blogger “Waratah” on my website. Will he/she please contact me?

    Many thanks!

    Marcus

  5. Bruce Bradbury
    August 30th, 2006 at 10:30 | #5

    Interesting to see Alan Kohler arguing that David Murray might be the one to split Telstra (see here). Can we hope that the market will lead to a reasonable public policy outcome after all?

  6. observa
    August 30th, 2006 at 10:58 | #6

    Looks like there’s a bloody good stoush developing with Alexander taking up the cudgel for the bloggers against the big bad NGO here http://www.news.com.au/story/0,10117,20298594-401,00.html?from=public_rss
    The International Red Cross is about to be put under the spotlight of bloggerdom as is the misuse of ambulances by Islamists in the ME.

  7. Stephen Hill
    August 30th, 2006 at 12:15 | #7

    I think you’ll find Downer fell for a hoax observa, I hope he has more reliable information, considering his liking for that charlatan Mark Steyn I’m more than a little worried.

    http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,20300357-2702,00.html

  8. observa
    August 30th, 2006 at 13:29 | #8

    The question is who is falling for a hoax. It may be that an(two?) ambulance was struck by Israeli fire of some kind causing the casualties reported and we media consumers have been presented with some convenient pictures for that purpose. However if the ambulance pictured in reports is really supposed to be the target in question, then there are some serious doubts about the reported facts as raised. This may be a matter of rocket science vs propaganda and we’re entitled to the truth.

  9. observa
    August 30th, 2006 at 13:57 | #9

    For example from my linked News report above we have-

    ‘Last night, the group manager of the first-aid team for the Lebanese Red Cross, George Kettneh, insisted that two LRC ambulances had been attacked on the night of July 23, near Qana in southern Lebanon.

    “I was on duty that night and every ambulance that moved in Lebanon I had to know about,” he said.

    “I received phone calls from the ambulance drivers and it took us one hour to negotiate a ceasefire through the International Committee of the Red Cross.”

    Ambulance driver Qassem Shalim was closing the doors of the ambulance when the vehicle was hit.

    “I am sure the missile was fired from a drone. The blue light was flashing on our roof, the red cross was clear and there was a light on the Lebanese Red Cross flag above me. Everything I said happened did happen,” he told The Australian in Beirut.’

    Then from the Zombietime website Associated Press reports-

    ‘…the Lebanese Red Cross suspended operations outside Tyre after Israeli jets blasted two ambulances with rockets, said Ali Deebe, a Red Cross spokesman in Tyre.’

    Hmmm… rockets from Israeli jets OR drones eh Red Cross?

  10. sdfc
    August 30th, 2006 at 14:59 | #10

    “Hmmm… rockets from Israeli jets OR drones eh Red Cross?”

    Does it matter?

    What point exactly are you trying to make other than perhaps making a bid for the clutching at straws championship?

  11. observa
    August 30th, 2006 at 15:47 | #11

    “Does it matter?”
    http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/pictures/JER50D.htm
    http://www.debka.com/article.php?aid=1192
    It’s like having 2 witnesses, one saying he reckons the mugger was a negro and the other saying he was chinese. What the hell, they both had two legs your honour!
    In this particular case they both had wings and flew I suppose.

  12. observa
    August 30th, 2006 at 16:03 | #12

    I am assuming of course that our adamant and experienced ambulance driver Quassem Shalim is not claiming it was one of these http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3571261.stm

  13. FDB
    August 30th, 2006 at 18:01 | #13

    There’s an excellent case made for it being a hoax on the site Dolly was tossing over. It’s a site with a pretty clear agenda, but not everything a ‘wierd dude’ says is to be discarded.

    Don’t let’s fall into the RWDB trap of only looking at the evidence that suits us, eh?

  14. sdfc
    August 30th, 2006 at 21:19 | #14

    No it doesn’t matter, negligence is not much of an excuse.

    If a drunk driver crashed into your car, killing your family, would you take solace from the fact he probably didn’t mean it?

  15. Stephen Hill
    August 31st, 2006 at 18:09 | #15

    There is more in the Australian’s Media section today, considering the Oz’s Middle East correspondent was in the vicinity, I think he is a more reliable source than the zombie whatever-its-name-is website.

    http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,20307128-7582,00.html

    “I was in Tyre on the night of the attack and investigated the incident closely the next day. On July 24, with photographer Stewart Innes, we spoke to Qassem Shalin, who was recovering from a minor wound to his chin that nurses had bandaged to stop it from turning septic. We also visited Ahmed Mohammed Fawaz, whose lower left leg had been amputated and whose severe burns ironically had saved his life by sealing blood vessels and arteries. His son writhed in pain nearby, his stomach riddled with shrapnel and the rear of his scalp opened up.

    We inspected both ambulances, whose mangled roofs were not rusting at the time. By the time the photos used on the blog site were taken, rust had appeared. But this is entirely normal in Lebanon’s sultry summer climate, where humidity on the coast does not drop below 70per cent.

    Downer’s spokesman, Tony Parkinson, said on Tuesday: “Those (website) pictures do not show an ambulance that has been struck by a missile nor do they sustain the argument the ambulance was struck by a missile.”

    He is wrong. The damage done was consistent with ruined cars and vans that I saw elsewhere in Lebanon and earlier in Gaza, which had been hit by a missile fired from a drone. The Israeli-made drones have many types of missiles, but the most regularly used has a small warhead designed for use in urban areas. It aims not to kill anyone outside a small zone and rarely leaves a calling card outside its target.

    Downer and Parkinson should know this. The Australian Government last year signed a deal to buy drones from Israel. They would surely have come with a buyer’s guide.”

  16. September 3rd, 2006 at 07:25 | #16

    Stephen,

    that would be the small non exploding missile (ie a large bullet) theory?
    ZT accepted this was possible and I think it is quite likely. The problem however is it still holds up ZT’s main point that it was shoddy reporting as is the following.

    > where humidity on the coast does not drop below 70per cent.

    1) that is hard to believe since the weather reports have it far below 70% (check yourself)
    Also quana is not on the coast. Does this guy think we are idiots?

    > He is wrong. The damage done was consistent with ruined cars and vans that I saw elsewhere in Lebanon and earlier in Gaza, which had been hit by a missile fired from a drone.

    hmm it is still unusual, usually even these missiles cause a big hole in the roof – still i guess it was helped by the fact that it was shooting directly into an air vent.

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