8 thoughts on “Monday Message Board”

1. Sport was the poorer for last week.
   first we had the 50th Anniversary of the first 4 minute mile.
   however it should have gone to John Landy not Roger Bannister. This is because John Landy ran in a race whilst Bannister merely had pacemakers.

   Then we had a new world record in test cricket for the amount of test wickets taken. Unfortunatelt the person who took is a blatant chucker and should not be allowed to ‘bowl’ in any form of cricket.

2. John, I wonder what you and the list make of Clive Hamilton’s Growth Fetish, a book I’ve only recently gotten around to reading.

   I admire Hamilton’s demolition of the endless focus on that proxy for progress, economic growth, but this comment is a request for a debate about his caricature of ‘the left’ and its continuing effort to lever low income and low waged people into higher incomes.

   Hamilton seems to see high levels of consumption across all stratas of society, and I’m asking who agrees.

   The thing about consumption is that its conspicuous, and its all too easy to miss the very low standards of living, and still outright poverty, of somewhere between the bottom 20 per cent and 40 per cent of the population.

   The Australian, via George Megalogenis and I think it was the Melbourne Institute, a month or two ago had a series of informative features, with detailed tax tables, that seemed to me derailed much if Hamilton’s thesis.

   Apologies if this is an old debate for this forum.

   Ian.

3. We did indeed discuss this when the book came out, Ian, but I would certainly be happy to reopen the debate. We certainly didn’t resolve all the issues the first time around.

   Here’s one comment from me and you can find others using the search facility (try “hamilton” or “Growth Fetish”)

4. One critic said that Hamilton’s idea of consumption was a overweight guy eating a jam donut.

   I agree with a lot of what Hamilton says in Growth Fetish but I think he puts to much stress on consumption which is motivated by greed and not enough on that which is motivated by social needs like that for belonging and approval.

   Economic growth makes some things more affordable for those at the bottom of the income distribution (eg DVD players) but leaves other things still out of reach (eg visiting the dentist).

   Durable consumer goods become far cheaper but services and positional goods do not. No matter how much extra a childcare worker is paid unless her relative earnings increase she still won’t be able to afford to buy a house close to public transport, good schools, hospitals, and other public facilities (Question: can childcare workers afford childcare?).

   Things like cheap cars and DVD players can create an illusion of enhanced well-being when basic services like health, education, and housing are becoming harder and harder to afford.

   In front of the Senate inquiry into poverty Hamilton complained that too many Australians have deluded themselves into thinking that they are battlers. But it seems to me that he misunderstands where much of the pressure to spend is coming from.

   Much of this spending is driven by social obligation rather than greed. If your child’s pet dog can be saved for $1000 then maybe you let the electricity bill slide. If you want your kids to get a scarce publicly funded university place then maybe you’ll pay for private education and take your holiday in front of the tv instead of going down the coast. And if an orthodontist can fix your child’s teeth and protect them from being teased at school then maybe you’ll stop eating out.

   In The Joyless Economy Tibor Scitovsky warned against being overly judgemental about the money people spend in order to fit in. The need to belong is something basic and human.

   Many economists have argued that we need to take collective action against spending for position (a zero sum game). Alred Marshall warned against it, Thorstein Veblen denounced it, and Robert Frank has written about how it affects today’s Americans.

   Sometimes the ability to do something ends up as a requirement. Household washing and cleaning appliances are one example. Washing machines led to more washing rather than more leisure time. Now wearing the same shirt to the office several days in a row carries a far higher penalty than it once did. The neatness and cleanliness of your clothes is taken as a signal of how much you care about your job.

   Stoicism has always been more popular among those who own the houses they live in and whose investments in human capital protect them from future unemployment.

   For most low income earners downsizing means being unable to afford to live near employment and public services and being unable to meet obligations to family.

   For children shoes were once a luxury. Try sending your kids to school barefoot today.

5. Which was the first significant Ricardo people round here ever heard of, David Ricardo the stockbroker gone wrong, Harry Ricardo the engineer made good, or some other? Engineers are at least as useful as dentists, when all is said and done.

6. Which season is best?

   Fall. As much as I love Australia, I don’t think I could ever move someplace where the leaves stay green all year.

7. Dentistry is a kind of engineering. If it was medicine, we would get it on public health. Wouldn’t we?

   That post from Don was very very lucid. Thanks.

8. Stentor, having lived in the deep south for four years I can understand how you feel. What I love about here (Brissie) is that something is flowering all year.

   Ditto about Don’s post – excellent as usual.

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